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	Comments on: Bioshock Infinite: Violence for Violence&#8217;s Sake	</title>
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	<link>https://kingofnovember.com/2013/05/bioshock-infinite-violence-for-violences-sake/</link>
	<description>I&#039;ve had some whiskey, and I&#039;ve been thinkin&#039;.</description>
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		<title>
		By: Norrdec aka Peter Labuda		</title>
		<link>https://kingofnovember.com/2013/05/bioshock-infinite-violence-for-violences-sake/comment-page-1/#comment-5933</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Norrdec aka Peter Labuda]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 May 2013 07:58:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://kingofnovember.com/?p=2657#comment-5933</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I think you are both missing some facts. Booker didn&#039;t know what happened exactly (his mind is a state of disarray, he doesn&#039;t recall anything). The debts? Already gone - the &quot;get us the girl&quot; part was his past. But we only learn that after. The husk of a man which was left  of Booker after he lost his wife? He sold his baby girl!
The trip to Infinity is not really about getting the debt erased. It&#039;s about saving his DAUGHTER. Its about redemption for being a bad person. He was a murderer and couldn&#039;t find redemption in baptism or in the bottle.

The last scene of the game. He knew he needs to die, before he is born a new man. Is a man really changed after his baptism? Not to mention we can see how many realities are there - we cam see all the Elizabeth&#039;s around us.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you are both missing some facts. Booker didn&#8217;t know what happened exactly (his mind is a state of disarray, he doesn&#8217;t recall anything). The debts? Already gone &#8211; the &#8220;get us the girl&#8221; part was his past. But we only learn that after. The husk of a man which was left  of Booker after he lost his wife? He sold his baby girl!<br />
The trip to Infinity is not really about getting the debt erased. It&#8217;s about saving his DAUGHTER. Its about redemption for being a bad person. He was a murderer and couldn&#8217;t find redemption in baptism or in the bottle.</p>
<p>The last scene of the game. He knew he needs to die, before he is born a new man. Is a man really changed after his baptism? Not to mention we can see how many realities are there &#8211; we cam see all the Elizabeth&#8217;s around us.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Teksura		</title>
		<link>https://kingofnovember.com/2013/05/bioshock-infinite-violence-for-violences-sake/comment-page-1/#comment-5932</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Teksura]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 May 2013 06:34:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://kingofnovember.com/?p=2657#comment-5932</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[jorm, I think you may have glossed over the fact that moments before you used that hand-held chainsaw device to chop off some faces, the two policemen holding you were just a few sadistic seconds away from using that same hand-held chainsaw device to chop off YOUR face. When someone wants to murder you because of a tattoo which tells them you&#039;re evil - and has a hand-held chainsaw device just inches from your face - I&#039;m not seeing any peaceful way out of that.

To me, the city was not at all what it pretended to be. Sure, it tried to put on a pretty face. But the sheer level of self-righteousness was staggering. To me, it felt like the entire city revolved around the glorification of its leaders, and keeping as may people beneath you as compliant as possible. As one example, Fink is obviously exploiting his workers. 16 hour work days. No weekends off. No holidays. Pay is only usable in the company store. And he broadcasts a constant stream of propaganda to his employees to convince them that they ought to THANK Fink for the PRIVILEGE of all of this. This is not a good guy, but the city tries to present him as an outstanding member of society. 


Booker only got violent when he was met with violence from what I&#039;ve seen. The man was jaded, and to me he seemed tired of fighting. When in the Hall of Heroes fighting against Slate&#039;s men, Booker is almost constantly begging Slate to stop sending his men to their deaths at his hands. He doesn&#039;t WANT to fight Slate or his men. He just wanted to get the damn Shock Jocky vigor so he could get the hell out of that city. 

That said, I agree with you that the story was missing a critical part. Except I believe that missing part could have been filled by better establishing that the city was not the paradise it pretended to be. Booker could have been arrested at the lottery by those policemen. He could have been dragged away by some laughing policemen talking about how much fun they&#039;re going to have now. Booker could have been knocked out, and awakened in a horrible looking cell in something which could only be described as a dungeon. Implements of torture could have been visible Booker could have spoken to other inmates about what really goes on in the city, and have learned more about what really goes on in the city. Booker could have watched his cell mate tortured to death, all the while screaming at the sadistic cops who are laughing and taking a perverse pleasure in their act. Booker could have gotten mad. And when they opened the cell to do the same to Booker, he could have broken out the violence without a single doubt in his mind that these people needed to be stopped. 

The game could have then focused a little less on &quot;rescue the girl and get the hell out of dodge&quot;, and a little more on righting a wrong. Booker could have rescued Elizabeth not because he was told to do so in exchange for wiping his debt clean, but because leaving her locked away like that wouldn&#039;t be right. They went to some pretty great lengths to paint the major names as bad dudes, but they really dropped the ball on the lesser dudes who are killed by Booker by the dozens. They portrayed them as racist, sure. But racism alone does not equate to being evil on a fundamental level. They really needed to show that the enemies you faced NEEDED to die because others were suffering at their hands. To me, they tried to show this, but fell a bit short.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jorm, I think you may have glossed over the fact that moments before you used that hand-held chainsaw device to chop off some faces, the two policemen holding you were just a few sadistic seconds away from using that same hand-held chainsaw device to chop off YOUR face. When someone wants to murder you because of a tattoo which tells them you&#8217;re evil &#8211; and has a hand-held chainsaw device just inches from your face &#8211; I&#8217;m not seeing any peaceful way out of that.</p>
<p>To me, the city was not at all what it pretended to be. Sure, it tried to put on a pretty face. But the sheer level of self-righteousness was staggering. To me, it felt like the entire city revolved around the glorification of its leaders, and keeping as may people beneath you as compliant as possible. As one example, Fink is obviously exploiting his workers. 16 hour work days. No weekends off. No holidays. Pay is only usable in the company store. And he broadcasts a constant stream of propaganda to his employees to convince them that they ought to THANK Fink for the PRIVILEGE of all of this. This is not a good guy, but the city tries to present him as an outstanding member of society. </p>
<p>Booker only got violent when he was met with violence from what I&#8217;ve seen. The man was jaded, and to me he seemed tired of fighting. When in the Hall of Heroes fighting against Slate&#8217;s men, Booker is almost constantly begging Slate to stop sending his men to their deaths at his hands. He doesn&#8217;t WANT to fight Slate or his men. He just wanted to get the damn Shock Jocky vigor so he could get the hell out of that city. </p>
<p>That said, I agree with you that the story was missing a critical part. Except I believe that missing part could have been filled by better establishing that the city was not the paradise it pretended to be. Booker could have been arrested at the lottery by those policemen. He could have been dragged away by some laughing policemen talking about how much fun they&#8217;re going to have now. Booker could have been knocked out, and awakened in a horrible looking cell in something which could only be described as a dungeon. Implements of torture could have been visible Booker could have spoken to other inmates about what really goes on in the city, and have learned more about what really goes on in the city. Booker could have watched his cell mate tortured to death, all the while screaming at the sadistic cops who are laughing and taking a perverse pleasure in their act. Booker could have gotten mad. And when they opened the cell to do the same to Booker, he could have broken out the violence without a single doubt in his mind that these people needed to be stopped. </p>
<p>The game could have then focused a little less on &#8220;rescue the girl and get the hell out of dodge&#8221;, and a little more on righting a wrong. Booker could have rescued Elizabeth not because he was told to do so in exchange for wiping his debt clean, but because leaving her locked away like that wouldn&#8217;t be right. They went to some pretty great lengths to paint the major names as bad dudes, but they really dropped the ball on the lesser dudes who are killed by Booker by the dozens. They portrayed them as racist, sure. But racism alone does not equate to being evil on a fundamental level. They really needed to show that the enemies you faced NEEDED to die because others were suffering at their hands. To me, they tried to show this, but fell a bit short.</p>
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